Started Reading “No More Mr. Nice Guy”

Dr. Robert Glover’s “No More Mr. Nice Guy” has been a longtime recommendation of a number of bloggers and commenters in the male writer’s community. It has been a standard recommendation on the Married Man Sex Life forums (along with Athol Kay’s own books, of course).

glover

I acquired a copy recently and have just started into it. Truth be told, I couldn’t make it past page 5 without having to stop for a minute. The author’s description of some of his patients, who give without limit and are awarded almost nothing but misery in return, are heartbreaking, and also serve as emotional reminders of times when I was the same guy.

In the opening pages, Dr. Glover identifies the “Nice Guy” as (these are my words) a pathological altruist driven by a self-definition built around helping others to a fault, and especially based around seeking the approval of women, and links their proliferation to dramatic social changes from the 60′s to today. He’s not just talking about saps in general – he’s addressing the social conditioning of men that causes them to seek external approval in place of finding confidence and dignity within themselves.

It markets itself – and the comments I’ve read have backed this up as a success – as a strategy guide for remaking your behavior and mental models as a man, akin to what “The Mystery Method” or Roosh’s “Bang” can do for a single man’s sex life.

I’m curious about the readership’s experience. Has anybody read it or implemented its advice, did you identify with it, and how did it work?

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14 Comments

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14 responses to “Started Reading “No More Mr. Nice Guy”

  1. LongLostFriend

    This book broke me of my Nice Guy-ness. For me, reading it preceded my discovery of the Manosphere; and Glover might as well have interviewed me for the book, for all of the resemblance between his patients and myself.

    Embracing what Glover recommends caused me to do a 180 in my dealings with women, and it eventually made the Red Pill a very easy thing for me to swallow.

  2. Great book. This book is what brought me here. Found it via google, bought it, then somehow found Athol Kay from there, and the rest was a very short hop.

    While I shared most of the base Nice Guy worldview, the book profiles seemed much worse than I ever got, by orders of magnitude. I simply didn’t have the *present* problems that they did, only the nagging sense that something was missing and very wrong.

    Either I got lucky, or, I had some baseline immunity to full-blown NGness resulting in the worst sexless “gamma” behaviors. That said, if I had continued on my current course at age 18 and, had not gotten laid in college, I could have wound up there, easily.

    Glover says that implementing his suggestions to a relationship will either improve a relationship beyond your expectations, or, send it to a long-overdue grave. I took the risk and, it wound up being the first.

    What you know of me now is all post-NMMNG. I credit it from busting me out of a “Vox delta” to a “Vox beta”.

  3. Stand Watie

    I found NMMNG just after my ex-wife left me for one of the librarians at the university where she was “studying for her doctorate” a few months after the birth of my son. I was a mess, needless to say, because I’d been trying to “fix” her exponentially increasing bitchiness for the seven years by trying to be nicer. Surely I just needed to try harder to be nicer, right? I must just not be doing it right …

    Suddenly, it all made sense.

    Best I can remember I went from NMMNG to _When I Say No, I Feel Guilty_ (Manuel Smith) and learned how to actually be assertive, and I have no clue how I stumbled on Dalrock, CH, Vox, you, etc.

    It’s been about twenty-one months now since I read NMMNG. Implementing the advice was exceptionally difficult because I was terrified of being anything that approached assertive, but it completely turned my life around.

  4. It was my first reading of anything on masculinity and mental/social health besides manosphere blogs. It will always be my first recommendation to anyone dealing with these issues, regardless of background. It gave me a great foundation for reading the 21 laws of leadership, 48 laws of power, and then delving into classical literature with Iliad and odessey.

    Its a must read for modern masculinity if you have any issues as a codependent

  5. RomanCandle

    I see this was published in 2003. I’m always interested in proto-manosphere works, so I’m downloading it right now.

  6. I wrote a fairly lengthy piece (about 2500 words) at Return of Kings about the book:

    http://www.returnofkings.com/14332/fatso-the-damning-codependency-of-betas

  7. Yup. very good book. keeps you focused on yourself and your mission, and is grounded enough to help you not turn into a flaming asshole, once you realize how bad your conditioning is.

  8. RG3

    I thought the book was extreme, but purposefully so, as to define clear “archetypes” of various dysfunctional Nice Guys. These archetypes are very helpful for discussion and analysis.

    However, most of Glover’s cases suffered from massive immaturity along with the usual blue pill programming. I wanted to open-hand bitch smack many of his guys, for their snivelliness.

    It’s one thing to be enchained by destructive social programming, in need of emancipation. A whole another thing to just be a dumb little bitch of a man.

    Most Nice Guys Who Suck at Relationships that I know personally would benefit way more from standard manosphere re-programming than exploring their psychological pathos. This book leans towards the latter.

    So, a useful book at best but not Necessary and definitely not Sufficient. And btw, the writing sucks; Badge, you are a far better writer than Glover.

    http://offensearchives.com/2013/03/02/nice-guy-deconstruction/

  9. Pingback: A Great Analogy on Scarcity Mentality | The Badger Hut

  10. dkb

    This book changed my life forever. It was eye opening and literally hit me between the eyes. It spoke to me in ways that were so profound and accurate. I did not know or understand at the time what I was doing was perpetuating a spiral to divorce. It brought me to MMSL and eventually your blog. My parents divorced when I was eight and as the oldest, I took on the responsibility of taking care of my siblings. But I saw my mother so heart broken that I swore I would never be the Jerk that my dad was and I began to do anything and everything I could to please my mother, be a good student and make others happy before myself. I married my wife because I didn’t want to disappoint her. That led to a sexless marriage until I found this book. Once I decided that I was ready to make the change at any consequence, I was able to become more attractive to my wife. Little did I know, that was what she has wanted from me from the beginning. It wasn’t easy, pleasant or comfortable, but we are so much better off today. And, I am myself around her all the time. That is a huge step for me. I finally understood why I was behaving the way I was and I immediately made the changes which led me to a wonderful, sex filled, alpha-in-control marriage! I’m one happy man and my wife respects me and loves being led by me. We are now about to celebrate our 24th year together with a sex filled weekend getaway! This book was so “me” that it was obvious why I was behaving the way I was. I wish I could have had those years back, however my son has now seen me a new man and he is learning how to stand up for himself. I’m thankful for breaking that cycle and I can now move forward. I gave this book to my dad for his 4th marriage. He left my mother because he was insecure and not man enough to take charge, not because he was an alpha male deciding to go his own way. To this day, he has never read it. He is in a marriage that is literally repeating itself. A strong willed women, controlling him. He is unhappy and can’t figure out why. After all, he treats her so good and does so much for her! She should reciprocate that right? Not even close! Good luck with the book. I know you are well past the nuts and bolts of this book, but fully understanding why we as men act and behave the way we do is eye opening. Thanks again for your blog,

  11. One of the better books I have read.

  12. I found the book uninteresting. The type of “nice guy” it addresses is too far removed from anything I can relate to.

  13. Even after reading the comments – thinking of that book brings a tear to my eye, because it was really the first one that I read — it’s a tough read, and even harder to really process. I became active on the forum there – then read Athol’s book, then David Dieda’s — it opened my eyes. From there I’ve read the blogs and other books – but NMMNG started it all for me.

    But I found that book by buying Divorce Busters – didn’t work and really was just too generic for a Man to really make it work then the Doc’s book just made sense.

  14. The (largely) accurate way I often hear it put is: NMMNG tells you how you got to where you are. MMSL and the Manosphere tell you how to fix it.

    It’s an interesting read. I identified with some but not all of the described “nice guy” traits and behaviors. There was a healthy helping of “there but for the grace of God go I”. But while it was interesting in an explanatory way, I didn’t think much of its proposed solutions, which were too vague and touchy-feely and not actionable enough for my tastes. When looking to extricate myself from a problem situation, I’m more interested in what concrete steps to take; identifying how I got there is secondary and can be done in hindsight.

    I’d call it a good read for almost anyone, but not required reading for most men.

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