Two Encounters This Week

Earlier this week I walking from my car to a park where my young-adult sports league was playing. Waiting to cross the street with me were two young women, one carrying a box of beer and the other a bag and a comforter.

I hadn’t even made eye contact when the latter said to me, “are you any good at carrying blankets?”

Of all the things I’ve been asked, that’s not one of them. “I can’t say I’ve been trained for it, no.”

“Can you help me carry this?”

I’m a charitable guy but I certainly wasn’t interested in helping an able-bodied person set up a picnic I wasn’t invited to; nonetheless I recalled Athol Kay’s post on getting something out of being a white knight.

I gazed longingly at the box of beer and said slyly, “what’s in it for me?”

She replied plainly “never mind” and they walked across the street.

The exchange befuddled me. Given the way it turned out it certainly wasn’t an IOI. Maybe she’s the type who is accustomed to random men doing things for her when she smiles and asks nicely. Reminds me of a story that went around my college. A student batted her eyelashes at the professor and cooed, “I’ll do ANYTHING for an A!” The professor looked her straight in the eye and said, “…study.”

Also this week I went to get my morning coffee. In line I noticed a young woman wearing gear from a sports team in a city I used to live in. I happened to be wearing a tshirt of said team, so I made eye contact with her and with a cocky smile pointed at my shirt. She laughed and gave me a thumbs-up.

Lo and behold, she was still at the milk-and-cream station when I was done paying, so I sidled up under the pretext of grabbing a napkin and asked her if she was from up there or just liked the team. She told me she’d just moved into town, which communicated my tshirt had built instant rapport and comfort. We talked for a block until she dashed into her apartment building; I didn’t even have time to grill-close her by inviting her to my weekend cookout.

Is this some brilliant day-game pickup? Not at all. But it’s an application of Roissy’s principle that opportunity is everywhere. Who knows what fruit it might bear. If I see her again, we pick up where we left off. Maybe I see her again with a companion who is a candidate. Maybe other women noticed me with her and they’re more open to being opened next time around.

Or maybe none of that happens, and I just had a nice thirty-second chat with a pretty girl. Not everything has to be for a reason.

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39 Comments

Filed under dating and field game

39 responses to “Two Encounters This Week

  1. Day Game is awesome. Girl #1 was definitely an entitled princess. No loss there, but I liked the way you handled yourself. You can probably arrange a run-in with Girl #2 easily enough – same coffee spot, same time, walking by her building, etc. It’s all about expanding the web of connections – like you said, if she’s not available perhaps her sister or friend is.

    Women love meeting guys during the day. It’s less threatening and the stakes are lower. It’s fun to have 30 second chats with attractive men!

  2. P.S. Don’t want to tell you how to title your posts, but something including Day Game is going to bring you Google searchers. I am terrible at this myself, I tend to write meaningless headlines. :) I’m trying to get better though.

  3. Susan,

    “Women love meeting guys during the day. It’s less threatening and the stakes are lower. It’s fun to have 30 second chats with attractive men!”

    One of the axioms of PUA game, so fundamental it’s often unsaid, is that most women out in public are open to be chatted up by attractive, interesting men. They welcome it happening. This goes double if they are at a bar/club/meat market.

    “something including Day Game is going to bring you Google searchers”

    True, but “encounters” will bring the prowlers ;)

  4. detinennui32

    I’ve had a bit of difficulty swallowing the “chivalry is dead” part of the red pill, but I’m digesting it just the same. Single guys, don’t rescue or come to the aid of women you don’t know unless there’s something in it for you. I know it sounds crass, but it’s the world we now live in.

    Opportunity truly is everywhere. Don’t miss chances to chat up girls everywhere. Even if you don’t number close, you’re improving your confidence and ability to talk to and interact with people. That’s always valuable. Plus you never know who might be watching — you might just be DHV’ing yourself all over the place. Most men just don’t chat up or talk to women they don’t know because they don’t ratchet up the nerve. When you’re out there doing it, you’re DHV’ing yourself above 95% of the other guys.

  5. “When you’re out there doing it, you’re DHV’ing yourself above 95% of the other guys.”

    Bingo. Talking to a woman in a day-game environment is a major differentiator, because most guys don’t do it at all.

    Talk to hot women who go out in public. They’ll tell you they get gawked at far more than they get opened. Be the latter guy.

  6. detinennui32

    The world is a day game environment. Home, the grocery store, the post office, the office (treading lightly and carefully), the ticket line; the social event. Even church.

    Learn it, know it, live it.

  7. detinennui32

    OT: Badg, what is

    TL:DR?

    Thanks.

  8. “I’ve had a bit of difficulty swallowing the “chivalry is dead” part of the red pill, but I’m digesting it just the same. Single guys, don’t rescue or come to the aid of women you don’t know unless there’s something in it for you. I know it sounds crass, but it’s the world we now live in.”

    This woman wasn’t in any kind of hardship, she just didn’t want to be bothered carrying a not-heavy object if she could pawn it off on a male passerby.

    As for intervening in violent or escalating situations, I don’t do it unless family, friends or lovers are involved. If the storm has passed and a victim is alone at the scene I might provide some help, but even then there’s a chance you get implicated in something you had nothing to do with (people might think you beat her up, etc).

    http://dalrock.wordpress.com/2011/06/13/lets-you-and-him-fight/

    In a society where the police and courts have a monopoly on coercive force, it’s a bad idea to wield your fists.

  9. TL;DR = “too long, didn’t read.” The Internet has shortened our attention spans.

  10. “Talk to hot women who go out in public. They’ll tell you they get gawked at far more than they get opened. Be the latter guy.”

    Badger +100.

  11. detinennui32

    “This woman wasn’t in any kind of hardship, she just didn’t want to be bothered carrying a not-heavy object if she could pawn it off on a male passerby.”

    True, Badg. But I gathered from the way you described the scene that Girl #1 was deploying feminine “charm” to either sway you or shame you into helping her. And she appeared to display some resentment and bewilderment when it didn’t work. She seemed to act as if you owed her a helping hand solely by virtue of your gender and your physical proximity, and when it wasn’t forthcoming, she walked off in a huff.

    I don’t want to sound cynical or jaded, but there’s not a little of this in my circles. Women seem to believe men HAVE to help them whenever and wherever they demand it. Men are hardwired to come to the aid of women, and women know this. There’s batting of eyelashes, smiling and faking IOIs at social situations or offices; women playing the damsel in distress to goad men into getting some help or, less often, rescuing them from a tight spot or serious trouble. I’ve even seen some women in professional situations play the tough equal, and then play the “those big mean old guys are all beating up on poor helpless little old me” card, expecting the white knights to ride in and save the day.

    Some women (not all, but some) seem to resent that men won’t automatically help them out just because they’re women. But it’s the way the world is now.

  12. johnnymilfquest

    On the issue of white knighting vs good deeds you have to ask:

    “Would I do this for a man? Or for a woman I wasn’t attracted to?”

    Unfortunately, hot girls are very likely to think that any interest shown in them or any disinterested assistance given to them is a come-on.

  13. Aldonza

    I know I’m going to get some heat for this, but some women do shit-test *for* beta traits where “passing the shit test” is actually failing for what she wants.

  14. Badger: “The Internet has shortened our attention spans.”

    I agreed with you until I thought about it. Then I decided that our attention spans are largely constant. tl;dr exists because the Internet has given us so much more to attend to. It takes extreme circumstances (of the Negro vs. Ice Cream Truck variety) to get me to watch a video someone links to. Nothing is more aggravating than an interesting headline that takes you to a podcast.

  15. Regarding search engine optimization. Guess who owns “butthex”.

  16. “but some women do shit-test *for* beta traits where “passing the shit test” is actually failing for what she wants.”

    are you implying this as in she’s SEEKING a “beta” male?

  17. SayWhaat

    are you implying this as in she’s SEEKING a “beta” male?

    As in, she’s seeking a male who will provide those beta traits.

    Signed,

    A Beta-Lover.

  18. Aldonza

    are you implying this as in she’s SEEKING a “beta” male?

    The princess with the blanket? Who knows. Just throwing it out there that some women actively screen *for* some of those traits, for a variety of reasons.

  19. If the woman is conscious of what she’s doing, it’s not a shit test. I can’t tell whether this is what Aldonza claims.

  20. SayWhaat

    Just throwing it out there that some women actively screen *for* some of those traits, for a variety of reasons.

    An example of this would be paying for a date. Most women want men to pay, especially on the first date. Not because we aren’t self-sufficient, but because we really, REALLY appreciate the gesture. Yes, we’ll offer to go dutch, we’ll feel awkward when you say “don’t worry about it”, but we’ll thank you and appreciate you all the more for it. Paying for a date is a provider cue we’re responding to, which is beta in the sense that it signals that you have the resources and desire to take care of us.

  21. Retrenched

    Of course women do like some “beta” behavior, but if and only if it’s coming from a guy that they already find attractive. When unattractive men act “beta” for a woman it just gets them a one way ticket on a bullet train to the friend zone.

    Someone, Dennis Prager I think, once said that women want to be loved by the men that they admire. In the manosphere, we would say that they want “beta” behavior from men they find sufficiently “alpha”. Same thing really.

  22. i’ve told this to countless male friends that have come to me seeking relationship advice:

    “the key is learning to be decisive without being DICTATORIAL. you have to listen to/know her point of view, and use it to make the best decision that benefits you both.”

    you can’t thump your chest 24-7 and expect a woman to stick around. sure, you’ll get laid, and if that’s you MO……have fun. and as i’m sure most of the readers know, being beta all day is a no win either. so if you’re looking to sustain a relationship, learning to BALANCE alpha and beta is crucial. Athol’s proved it can be done.

  23. “I know I’m going to get some heat for this, but some women do shit-test *for* beta traits where “passing the shit test” is actually failing for what she wants.”

    This is a test, but not a fitness test the way we’ve evolved the term in these parts. A fitness/shit-test has a double bind or double benefit component to it – if he complies you get something you want (resources), if he declines you get something else you want (tingles).

    But yes, a wise woman screens for beta traits in an appropriate manner.

  24. If the woman is conscious of what she’s doing, it’s not a shit test.

    Is this true? I know I haven’t been conscious of shit testing at times, but at others I know perfectly well I’m showing a hoop and demanding the guy jump through. In fact, this is a high octane shit test – it’s a form of ultimatum. It’s very important for guys to push back hard on these.

    “the key is learning to be decisive without being DICTATORIAL. you have to listen to/know her point of view, and use it to make the best decision that benefits you both.”

    I object to the principle of the man as the ultimate decision maker in the couple. Maybe this is a matter of personal taste – there are still some women who prefer to be actively submissive in all things. Many of them live in Utah.

    It’s very possible to have social dominance and sexual dominance work very well in a relationship where important life decisions are handled in an egalitarian manner. It’s certainly my preference.

    “You are not the boss of me.”

    Perhaps this is another reason why quality modern women, especially intelligent ones, seek beta traits. Betas are much more cooperative and collaborative, and this is a plus from our POV.

  25. Susan, it is possible that I Humpty-Dumptied there.

  26. “I object to the principle of the man as the ultimate decision maker in the couple. Maybe this is a matter of personal taste – there are still some women who prefer to be actively submissive in all things. Many of them live in Utah.”

    agree to disagree susan. i respect your point-of-view, and i don’t EVER consider myself to be the omnipotent one in my relationships, but…for the most part i do believe (as athol puts it) i “steer the ship”. but i need her input as to know which direction we should head.
    again, to borrow athol’s logic- every captain need’s a first officer.

  27. Bb

    I object to the principle of the man as the ultimate decision maker in the couple. Maybe this is a matter of personal taste – there are still some women who prefer to be actively submissive in all things. Many of them live in Utah.

    It’s very possible to have social dominance and sexual dominance work very well in a relationship where important life decisions are handled in an egalitarian manner. It’s certainly my preference.

    This is also a preference for me, and I think mileages vary from relationship to relationship. I believe it’s more important that the couples agree to the style before going in. My husband leads in key areas (career, family size), but I can say that the majority of our decisions are handled in an egalitarian manner. I would have been uncomfortable otherwise, and remained unmarried.

  28. Looking Glass

    @ Susan Walsh: well, Bb & I discussed this a lot on her blog. You’re falling into a caricature of what the relationship dynamics ever have been.

    See: http://bbsez.wordpress.com/2011/06/08/the-ten-commandments/#comment-8

    Then Bb’s post & comments: http://bbsezmore.wordpress.com/2011/06/11/the-captain-and-the-stewardess/

    The trophy/Stepford wife ideas are Apex Fallacies, just like the Pure Alpha Male Privilege is in a similar manner. There are some that exist, but they really aren’t that common and they’re not what most guys want. (Men generally don’t like to micro-manage the life of someone else… that’s much more a female trait) That doesn’t mean it’s not like Athol’s Captain/First Officer setup in most functioning marriages. It just sort of is, but as Bb found out, what “being Captain” means compares very differently than what most people *think* it means.

  29. Vincent Ignatius

    “are you any good at carrying blankets?”

    No doubt in my mind, I would have laughed in her face.

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  31. Anonymous Reader

    From my perspective, the first encounter was with an entitled princess. Funny how fish don’t need bicycles except when they want something done, isn’t it? I’m not in the habit of asking strangers to assist me, as a rule, but when I do need some help the first word out of my mouth is either “excuse” or “please” ; “Excuse me, do you have the time to assist me / open this door while I carry this big box / etc.” or “Please, could you assist me / open this door while I carry this big box, etc.”.

    To presume that someone standing on a street corner with me just happens to have nothing better to do than carry something for me an undetermined distance would be arrogant at the very least. That someone might be on their way to an appointment, or to work, or going the opposite direction, and thus I would be imposing upon them.

    Going only by Badger’s description, it again strikes me as an entitled princess at work; she doesn’t bother to ask if he wishes to help, she just assumes that he’s willing to be her mule merely because she’s female, and he’s not. If it was intended as an IOI, it’s a fail, because it comes across as an indicator not of interest, but an indicator of demand. “Hey, boy! Carry this thing for me, as far as I wish you to, and then don’t bother me further”.

    This “I have a vagina so you will do things for me just because” attitude has become really very common among women under 30 in my experience. I see it when I’m standing in line to buy a coffee, in other stores, etc. It indicates an inability or an unwillingness to use simple, basic manners, and were I in the market such an attitude would be an instant disqualification for Badger’s Ladder 1. Not to beat a deceased equine further, but rude, arrogant and/or entitled people are not people I wish to assist, or associate with.

    Aldonza, as a man I see testing for betas differently. Most every man over a certain age has seen the “queen bee” who keeps a collection of beta orbiters around her to do things for her, to be her emotional tampon when one of her Alpha dates doesn’t work out, and to generally be her mule team. The interesting thing is that it seems to work best on men in their early 20’s, because most men, even hopelessly romantic betas, eventually figure out they are being used. Then they find something else to do, and someone else to do it with. Some years down the line, that game doesn’t work as well, either. Former queen bees from time to time attempt to recontact former beta orbiters – after they turn 30, it doesn’t work very well. To put this in terms feminists would understand, I find such women are clearly engaged in objectifying the men who are their beta orbiters; not as sex objects, but rather as some sort of tool, or robot. Most men don’t want to be robots…

    Perhaps you had something else in mind? But that’s what comes up from my own memories.

  32. Jennifer

    “What’s in it for me?” Not a Christian attitude. This is one of the nitpicks I disagree with; being a constant white knight is annoying (for both parties), but occasionally helping out wth no solid reward is just a nice gesture.

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  34. Anonymous Reader

    Jennifer
    “What’s in it for me?” Not a Christian attitude.

    I guess that’s true. Is demanding that a stranger perform services for you, when you are clearly capable of doing them yourself a Christian attitude? Is it Christian to essentially expect every male human being that you encounter in a day to be your pack mule, because you are female, all that Christian?

    This is one of the nitpicks I disagree with; being a constant white knight is annoying (for both parties), but occasionally helping out wth no solid reward is just a nice gesture.

    If a man standing next to you at a stop light whom you had never met asked you to do a service for him, no matter whether you wanted or not, would you do it? Assume he’s able bodied and healthy, and clearly capable of doing the task for himself.

    Honest answer, please?

  35. Eumaios

    Jennifer: “What’s in it for me?” Not a Christian attitude.

    Book, chapter, verse, or it didn’t happen.

  36. Jennifer,

    ““What’s in it for me?” Not a Christian attitude.”

    I completely disagree. Christ told us to tend his flock, feed his sheep. He didn’t tell followers to be chumps for able-bodied people who just don’t feel like putting in the effort. Would Christ have been happy if I’d carried her blanket and displaced energy and goodwill I could have spent on someone who really needed it?

    I’m really getting bothered with this “Nice Guy Christianity” shtick that’s been going around. Chumpitude backed up with bogus theology, and unattractive to boot.

    On another note, what kind of cheapos can’t spare a can of beer for a guy who helped them out?

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